Breathe Toys Fam

Kink Roundtable w/ the Breathe Toys Fam

In this Kink Roundtable episode we sat down with Emmett, Eli, and Crystal of the Breathe Toys family of kinksters. Emmett has been in the lifestyle for 10+ years and is one of the owners of Breathe Toys. Eli Munroe (E-liminal on fetlife) is an agender, queer, kinky, polyamorous, parent/grandparent, partner, chef and artist who shares their home and life with seven kids, a pack of dogs and their soul mate who puts up with their shit everyday. Crystal (sweetnfeisty on fetlife) is a bisexual, queer, kinky as fuck, switch, polyamourus educator/shop assistant/demo bottom who has over 20 years of kink experience and is submissive of Emmett and Dominant of Katicus.

Breathe Toys: https://www.breathetoys.com/

As You Like It: https://asyoulikeitshop.com/

Kink Roundtable w/ Breathe Toys Episode Transcript

This is The Subspace Exploration Project.

Join us for a deep dive into Kink, non-monogamy, mental and emotional health, gender expression and community building.

In each episode, we're deconstructing the gender binary, celebrating queer culture, and creating a safe space for sex education, all while learning from authors, educators, mental health professionals, and folks like you and me.

In this Kink Roundtable episode, we sat down with Emmett, Eli, and Crystal of the Breathe Toys family of kinksters.

Emmett has been in the lifestyle for 10 plus years and is one of the owners of Breathe Toys.

Eli Munroe, Eliminal on FetLife, is an agender, queer, kinky, polyamorous parent, grandparent, partner, chef, and artist who shares their home and life with seven kids, a pack of dogs, and their soulmate who puts up with their shit every day.

Crystal, sweet and feisty on FetLife, is a bisexual, queer, kinky-ass fuck, switch, polyamorous educator, shop assistant, demo bottom who has over 20 years of kink experience and is the submissive of Emmett and dominant of catechists.

So let's get into it.

My name is Emmett.

That's it.

I own Breathe Toys here in Eugene.

I do classes, teach classes on impact.

I've taught classes on breath play and waterboarding.

Just name is the name of that one.

I like it.

Poly, kitchen table poly preferably, obviously.

I mean, I'm in between them, so they're not killing each other.

Is that our delineation is kitchen table poly?

Yeah, because we can also do that.

We do not hang out in the kitchen.

That's because there's no where to hang out in the kitchen.

We've only sat around a table once.

Well, maybe.

We had a game night one night with Katie, so Matt sent us.

Game night table poly.

I like that better.

Game night table poly and camping poly.

Camping poly.

More on why that's more real.

We just do a lot of it together.

Camping.

Yeah.

A lot of events.

Crystal works a lot of the events for Breathe Toys with us.

Yeah.

It's kind of a family gig too.

So a bunch of my kids are kinky and also work the booth with us.

That's stuff that Crystal does.

And help out the shop.

So you travel and go to these events as a part of the camp, and you're traveling for these events?

We have one event that we go to the weekend, but it's a choir.

I mean, it's always camping.

You know, in a hotel with like seven people.

Yeah, that one hotel with the pool is definitely glamping.

It is, but yeah.

So, no.

Emmett and I are married.

But yeah, stay, but.

He insisted.

I had no intention of ever getting married again.

I was married for 20 years, so my kid's dad was done.

He was like happy to just be in a relationship.

Emmett and I dated in high school.

Like we were high school sweethearts and then didn't see each other for 25 years.

Then got back together and I was like, I love you, we're good, we're good, we're good.

We're happy, we're getting married.

He's like, but no, five years of begging, literal begging, yes you did, don't lie, don't lie.

And I was finally like, I guess if it means that much, you know.

I was very patient.

You were very patient, it was impressive, honestly.

It took you too long to answer.

Should have been instant no.

That's all right.

It's legal now, you can do shit about it.

So.

And I said yes.

I'm Crystal.

On Fet Life, I'm Sweet and Feisty.

I've been in the lifestyle about 20 years now.

Started out in the Southern Oregon Medford community.

And in my time there, I hosted munches, taught classes, hosted play parties, hosted drag shows, which was a lot of fun.

Moved up here about four years ago or so.

Yeah, it's been about four years now that I moved up here.

Polyamorous, Emmett and I, we've been together...

Three weeks, four weeks.

About four and a half, about four, four and a half years.

We actually met because he was teaching a class at Leatherwoods on...

Which is a kinky camping event.

Yes, we met at a kinky camping event.

See, it doesn't work better.

We should circle back.

But we met there because he was teaching a class on waterboarding and asked if anybody wanted to try it.

Of course, my hand went right up.

I think she almost tripped trying to get up to the table.

A little bit, yeah.

And then I have a partner that I live with.

She is, we're hoping to be married in April.

We've been together nine years now.

And?

Nice.

You're going to have a baby here in four months, too.

And we have a baby coming in four months.

And they live with Katie's partner also.

Yes.

And Katie is polyamorous and her partner lives with us.

He has his own room.

I have my own room.

And Katie swaps between the two rooms every three nights.

You realize how crazy the Venn diagram would look, right?

It's a whole bunch of circles.

You know, many years ago, I thought about if we did a whole diagram of, you know, if you kissed one person, how many people you're actually kissing.

That's gross, though.

It is so disgusting, because I did start to write it down.

And then after a couple of branches, I'm like, I can't do this.

My branches are worse in this account, my guy.

I'm like, nothing.

Yeah, that's us.

I'm talking about Kink Camp, unless there was something else that you're dying to go back about.

Yeah, right, Kink Camp.

Yeah, well, Leatherwoods is a local one.

Yes, and iffy as far as the folks, but a super, super fun event.

And then what's the other one?

Summer Spank.

Yeah, Summer Spank is another local Kink Camp that's super fun too.

Summer Spank is the same time as Tortuga.

Which is also, you know, in the vanilla world, Tortuga is kind of Kink Camping as well.

So we've ended that one and it's an adults only event.

So there's NASA, which has kids, it's a pirating event.

None not as Kinky, but the Tortuga is definitely like if you're kind of on the vanilla side of the world, you can kind of like sneak in your Kink Tortuga or Kinky Camping like undercover.

I sell more toys there than I do at some Kink events.

I mean, it's not like we're selling toys in the back room or anything.

That's pretty much the deal.

I am completely out with what I do in the world.

You see me and a lot of people just associated with Kink or with Breathe Toys.

You get a lot of sales at the Kink Camp events more so than other events?

No, no.

The actual Kink events, I get a lot of that right there.

This is what I do for Louie now.

The camping events are maybe once a year.

Is Kink Fest still the biggest event we do?

Kink Fest is currently still the biggest one.

It's our home event, so it's in Portland.

The festival is the first one we ever went to.

We'll be at Folsom for the second time this year, so we'll see.

We got a bit of a following in the Bay Area.

The nice thing about it is once I start to sell my toys and people buy them, they bring people to the booth and they sell them for me, which makes my job so much easier.

That's toys for themselves.

They do.

You pick up the toys and they just talk to you.

Yes.

It helps.

It does.

The jobs that I have really, the helpers, they're really helpful.

She does all the dying.

Call me a helper again.

She does all the dying for me and all the more hands-on stuff.

I just deal with you in general all the time.

That's my really my job.

I'm his handler.

They're both Emmett Wranglers.

I am an Emmett Wrangler.

That is reality.

That is reality.

It is reality.

It's hard to be an assistant white guy in this world, isn't it?

His entire family is queer as well.

He is, yep.

I know.

I signed up for it.

I know, I know.

I knew you back then.

You were pretty much the same person.

You love my hair.

I have less hair.

I think that's the most interesting quality about us as a couple, honestly.

And now with Crystal as the poly person, people expect it more with poly people, but we're completely out kink-wise.

Both of us are like, I have an old job and my boss knows I'm kinky.

My kids are kinky.

People are like, oh yeah, Eli is the one to ask.

People will be like, you're kinky, right?

Could I ask you a question?

I know.

I'm not as out because of what I do for work.

I do human resources.

And the company I work for, we have almost 300 employees.

And so that's something that I don't go around proclaiming, oh yeah, I'm kinky.

But my work knows I'm Polly.

They know I'm marrying a woman next year, and then I'm about to have a baby by that same woman.

Layers.

So many layers.

So many layers.

It's interesting to watch regular vanilla people's heads just melt when they try to, I mean, hell, sometimes my head just melts trying to wrap my head around all the different layers and circles and shit that's going on.

Yeah.

Oh, that seems pretty normal.

I mean, it is not.

I mean, it's always complete chaos.

We have seven kids and seven dogs, and a bunch of my kids live with us.

Life is chaos at this point.

There are some cats.

That's chaotic.

So the kink is kind of noise, honestly.

Before it goes to disappear.

A bit.

Kind of works out.

I think a lot of people go to kink as an escape.

There's a lot of therapy.

I see a lot of that.

I see a lot of therapy.

I see a lot of people wanting to feel something.

So I've.

Yeah, that's huge.

I've played with a lot of people that just need some catharsis.

They just need to get out of their head and feel something.

Yeah.

So I've helped quite a few people get there.

It feels really good.

It feels really good to help and not.

Kinship too.

Weird people congregate together and keep people weird.

So, you know, it's easy to be weird in whatever way you're weird.

You know, not be judged and yeah, it's good to have that.

Yeah.

It's like you have.

Yeah, exactly.

Exactly.

What's the hope anyway?

Is to create safe spaces.

Yeah.

Cross your fingers.

Yeah.

I'm, I'm a switch and like what he said with catharsis, when I'm submissive, it's because I'm looking for catharsis or I'm looking for that time to shut off my mind from the million different things that's going on at work and at home.

And everything that's going on is just like I can quiet it down.

For me, when I'm playing, it gives me, it's, it requires focus.

So it gives me, it gets me out of my head and lets me focus on what I'm doing to this person or people, because they're trusting me with their safety, whether it be physical or mental or emotional.

And I don't want to screw that up because I've seen what happens when bad things happen and the results from that.

So I like the focus.

I like being able to let everything around me, no matter how chaotic or loud or whatever it is, disappear and focus on whether I'm in an impact scene or needles or electric or breath play or whatever.

Like honoring them in a way.

Yes.

They're trusting me.

So I'm giving them as much as I possibly can.

That's me that's going to do it.

Yeah, that's true.

It's like kind of all or nothing.

It's half acid.

It's supposed to be fun or you're supposed to get something from it, whether it's fun or catharsis or the disconnect.

Then both sides need to be getting something from it.

So you two discovered Kink quite a bit later.

Sort of.

We discovered the Kink scene quite a bit later.

We were kinky when we were teenagers.

And then we moved up.

I moved up here.

We were teenagers.

Together.

It's not like.

Yes, no.

Agreed, agreed, agreed.

Don't do that.

And then I moved up here and a friend took us to a local party.

How did that even work?

Who was it?

Do you remember?

What's that name?

Casey.

Oh, right.

Yeah.

Wow.

Was that it?

That was our conversation.

We took one of our kids, who is Kinky, with us, and it was really hilarious.

We were kind of like shit starters.

And we didn't tell anybody she was our kid.

So everybody just thought she was our third.

And then somebody was like, I couldn't have been happier.

Our kids are shit starters too, so Sarah was into it.

But it was like, yeah, it was just really kind of funny.

Most people didn't care at all.

And actually, there was one person there who I'm still really great friends with.

He was younger, and he was so stoked.

He was like, oh, my God, I'm Kinky.

One of my parents is Kinky, and I'm so good to see you, family.

That's so cool.

It's not like we're Kinky together.

My kids are adults, man.

Like, calm the fuck down.

Most people are really good with it.

But it was kind of fun to have somebody who was young be like, oh, my God, this is so great.

It was totally fine.

I didn't think about it.

I'm going to beat on you next year at King of the Fields.

He's asking me.

He's the first one on the dance floor.

It's interesting.

The King scene has lots of people have preconceived notions about lots of things.

Just like in life.

Just like in life.

It's kind of fun to challenge that stuff.

The way they were raised over, and the people have a hard time sometimes getting rid of prejudices.

I think a lot of people also really like to be titillated by the wrongness of Kink.

The taboo.

The taboo, exactly.

And that's not my gig.

That's not why I like Kink.

And so I don't really play into that very much.

And they get a little shocked.

It's fun to refer to something as dirty or, you know, of course, of course, debauchery.

But I mean, yeah, like I'm very much into the therapy of it for myself and for others and the community and because it works with my neurodivergence, you know, like in all on all these different levels.

Yep.

It feels more at home to me than when I wasn't in Kink and things were taboo.

I'm like, I like it so much better now, you know, because you can talk about stuff.

I can do whatever I like.

You know, you're going to find somebody that wants to do exactly what you want to do.

Like it doesn't, you know, so I'm like, I can be like, oh, this is really like, instead of being like, oh, this is really bad.

It makes me feel bad.

I can be like, hmm, I wonder if I can find somebody who can do that with me.

I'm like, hmm.

And the answer usually is absolutely.

Absolutely.

I don't know if there will be a hundred thousand percent.

You just got to make sure that you vet them properly and that they're safe.

I mean, that's the real process.

Yeah, that's the reality.

I think it's interesting because that need to like have something be taboo is what keeps people from doing the right thing by themselves and vetting others and making sure they're safe.

And I'm like, no, wait, though, you can have all of that.

There's something for me and the people that I've played with.

There's something inherently connecting and intimate and sometimes very, very erotic and sexual about negotiating with someone and having them feel comfortable enough to tell you, I want you to do this to me.

That is very liberating.

That's a very powerful thing to have to feel trusting someone to go both ways.

Like, I want to do this to you.

So what if we both want this similar thing?

What if we twist it around and do this?

And they're sometimes like, some people are like, what do you want me to do?

You would never have thought of that.

Yeah, that's the fun part.

Yeah, negotiation is full-blank.

It's part of the scene.

Hard to agree.

Whether it's pick a play, you're negotiating right there at the party, or whether it's something you've been talking about for weeks or months.

Talk about catharsis, like going through those giant checklists of like, we'll do and won't do, and people are like, oh my god, I never even thought that people did this.

And I'm like, oh yeah, my god.

When I send a checklist to a new play partner, one of the questions I always ask is, okay, so I want you to come do this, but then when you're done with that checklist, I want you to tell me how many things you had to look up.

How much new terminology was added to your database?

That adds a lot more context to their answer.

Yeah, exactly.

It's like there's something down there.

Oh, the Lord and Bird wheel, by the way.

It's not the...

It's not what you use.

What is it?

No, it's a little roller thing.

It's like a nerve wheel.

It has little tiny needles on it.

It's originally a medical tool.

Designed to test nerves.

So they like rub it on your leg if they think you have a numb spot or whatever.

It's got tiny little, like, needle-like things on it.

I was picturing like being strapped to a wheel.

That's what I thought, too.

Well, I knew what a Whartonburg Rail was, but yes.

Maybe a wheel that would totally...

It would be clean up on aisle one.

Yeah.

You'd have to eat not eat first.

You can't feed in the morning.

Right when you get out of bed.

Okay, we're getting on the wheel.

That would be great.

No puke game.

Not one of my kinks.

Me neither.

Not a kink shame at all.

You're into it.

Great.

Not my game.

I wouldn't say I'm into throwing up, but I'm not opposed to getting through throwing up.

No, absolutely.

I agree.

Get through it.

Get it done.

But I'm not like, oh yeah.

Or puke on me.

Yeah.

Do you?

I watch a lot of stuff that I don't like.

Oh, fuck yeah.

I haven't seen a lot of piss kink and then we did Folsom, and oh my god, do those people love fucking pee?

And you know what?

They love it so much that I loved it.

I was like, this is amazing.

I don't want to get peed on, but goddamn.

There have been so many cases that I've looked at that I'm like, I fucking love your enthusiasm.

Yes, thank you.

I'm enthusiastic about it now, too.

That's right.

I may not do it, but come right here for you, buddy.

Yep, absolutely.

I love that.

I would love to bring my mom to a Kink event.

She is, in my discovery of sexuality in Kink, she was her erotica that I read.

It was no surprise to her when I finally had the conversation with her of like, here's why my life is getting better right now.

Nice.

She was like, I'm not sure.

I saw it in you.

Yes, right.

But sometimes I think about her life now and I'm like, come.

It's not over yet.

Yeah.

We have chocolate here.

Yeah, not nearly over yet.

She loves chocolate.

Fuck man, when we started going to parties in this town specifically, I'd say the average age was 60.

Yeah.

For real.

Average.

Yeah.

It was shocking.

I was like, damn, I'm young.

Not anymore.

It's like, holy shit.

That was a couple of weeks ago.

I wanted some good shit though.

I was like, I was submissive when we first came into the scene.

And I was like, okay, really quickly.

I was like, yeah, not so much.

And then I was like, I want to be a top though.

So I'm going to do that.

So I met this guy, this is older man from Kodriov, actually, and he played with anybody new who wants to learn how to top.

He would top you while you were topping him.

So he'd teach you while you were topping.

It was the coolest fucking thing.

That's genius.

Yeah, it was great.

Yeah, it was fantastic.

I learned so much about dicks and balls and like buttholes and bodies.

And just from like, he's like, do this to me.

But I had no idea, you know, would never have had that opportunity to learn how to top like that.

You were enjoying topping, but not necessarily dipping into a dom space?

It didn't at first.

I was just topping at first.

Emmett was a service top, always has been a service top.

So it was like kind of what I was watching happen.

And that was fine.

And then tried to dom a little.

I was very much a whole woman at that point.

So it was like I kind of did the dom thing.

And I was I was very much in my real life and in the Kink Scene cosplaying Cruella De Vil.

So, yeah, hard.

And it was a whole thing.

I didn't have any.

Oh, they don't have cameras that time?

That did not diss me at all.

Now I see.

Now I fucking see.

I'm aware.

I domed in that scene for a while as Kurodeville in my own way.

And that was interesting.

I domed some very interesting people.

I was like, maybe this is not my gig at all, actually.

I just started really getting up at the classes and teaching, which is what I like to do in my regular life anyway.

So we were hosting lots of meetups and groups at our house and labs where you teach people how to use tools.

And then we had a polykinky discussion group.

That was really well attended.

Lots of people got that.

We had open discussions where we would either have a person come in with a topic that they were interested in, a shout out, or one of us would do something.

And did a Dom Munch that was just for women only at the time and for top women.

And that was pretty well attended as well.

It was fun.

It was good.

And then COVID happened.

And then I was like, hmm, staying at home is great.

We weren't going to go do anything, so we were pretty tight because I work with a group of people in the vanilla world who can die easily from illness.

So there was not a chance I was going to parties or doing any of that kind of stuff, so everything connected really hard.

And then during COVID, several of our children decided to move back in.

Yep, we got kids who came home, which even now actually in this economy, it was understandable.

So that was fine though.

They're all kinky though, so it's not that huge a deal.

But no parties at bowels now.

But now we're trying to start, we have the munch again, which is really nice.

It took us a long time to decide to actually start doing things again, just because of truly every day.

It's like COVID's over.

Not really, but okay.

Like I'm not getting sick, and I can't get sick and go to work.

So I have to be super careful about that stuff, and it's better now.

So it's doable.

But that's my passion is the education.

I love the education, educating myself the whole time.

I love that.

I love people's point of view.

And people are very willing to talk.

We've been corrected pretty hard at some of these events.

I love that.

People are like, mmm, your take is shitty.

And I'm like, all right, hit me up.

What are we doing?

And I'm like, yeah, you're fucking right.

My whiteness is really coming through on this one.

Sorry.

Or whatever it is.

So that was really good.

I really enjoyed that.

And so that's my first go-to for us.

That's what I want to do again.

Munches are great, and they lead to great classes and discussion groups and stuff.

Again, now that he has a shop outside of the house, it's more doable.

The way I look at things is that if you have the experience and you have the knowledge and you can share it with someone and teach, then you're helping to bring these newbies into the lifestyle, and they're learning the correct way to do things.

They're learning the safe way, because some things can be done multiple different ways safely.

They're learning about how to vet people, how to negotiate, how to tie that rope a special way, how to do needles, consent, safe words.

What is a safe word?

A lot of people first coming in, they don't know any of that.

My first munch, I was 18 years old, one week post my 18th birthday, and I walked into a munch in Medford, and it was a room full of old people.

Yep, the old people, man.

It was a room full of old people, because I was fresh, I was 18, I was excited to learn about this, and everybody I looked at was old, and two of them kind of took me under their wing.

One was the mistress of the place, and then the other one was a dominant.

And they're like, you know, we're glad you're here.

What do you know about the lifestyle?

And I'm like, I know I'm interested in things.

They're like, okay, what things?

And I'm like, spanking?

They're like, oh, honey, there's so much more to it.

And so I was able to learn from them about the different aspects and safe words and negotiation and that it's okay to safe word as a top and as a bottom.

It's a full on culture.

So like this stepping in and being like, yeah, I'm here.

Well, it is a culture and it comes with the good things and the bad things of a culture.

So, you know, there are predators in the kink scene and there are people who just take advantage of brand new people.

You know, you can go to a big party that you go to all the time and you can sit there and watch a new person come in and you can watch the eight people you know are going to go hawk that person.

And you like you can watch it happen.

You can watch them leave with that person and then you never see that young person again.

Yeah, I mean, that's what I would like to avoid.

I would like for people to be able to be like, what is the what is the land of this culture?

What is the lay of this land?

And like, how can I step in?

I mean, safe is an interesting word in kink.

You know, confidently, right?

Knowing kind of what you're able to say, you know, just knowing you can say no is huge.

Knowing you can say no, anything you want, anytime you want, any way you want.

And it should be completely respected.

You can say no while it's happening.

I mean, anytime, that's the whole thing.

But I mean, that's huge for some people.

They're like, well, if I already said yes, I'm like, no, no, no.

You can renege on it.

Not at all.

You can renege on it.

Yeah, on anything you want, anytime you want.

So for newer people, definitely do your research.

Yes.

Yeah, and that's the thing is that new people are going to step in like Crystal and not having done research.

It's like, it'd be really nice if there was somebody at any event that could say, hey, you should go to this muncher, you should go check out this discussion group first and check that out.

You know, where people are going to be clothed and talking about that you can say no and you should vet.

There's just so much to it.

And it's like dumping on somebody.

Everything at once is so hard, you know, everybody just wants to go get laid or hit or whatever.

And they're like, geez, I got to do all this stuff.

It's like, well, yeah, do this stuff.

Maybe like go hit up some event where people are just hanging out talking, you know, people just like you, which is why munchers are so great, honestly, because there is so much, there's so much, it's so much, you know.

We just we just started doing classes at As You Like It here at EGN.

We've got another class next week down in Ashland.

We started with impact classes and we already talked to the owner that we're probably going to do a negotiation class.

That's probably going to be the next class that we set up.

I've had some friends ask if we can do like a CNC negotiation class, which is still the basic class, but CNC requires a deeper delving into everything basically.

So that we can everybody covers consent.

I'm confident usually that there's enough information out there about consent that even the average, even the average newbie understands that what yes means and what no means.

That doesn't mean that there are not people out there that are going to twist that and take advantage of it and say, well, you're a sub, you're supposed to do this.

I also think that new people coming in oftentimes come from heteronormative relationship kind of situations.

And the yes and the no in those situations, it's not just yes and no, is it?

We all have been there and it all comes with like these crazy like, well, I'm a girl.

And so my cultural training is that I say yes and then I hate it and then I'm mad at you.

And then everybody's got something.

And so coming into Kink, though, you have to, I don't want to judge you.

It's not like to do it safely.

There's no like safely.

But like to do it so you don't end up really regretting what's going on is you have to let some of that shit go.

And that stuff's hard.

I mean, that's hard to even recognize for a lot of people, right?

It's not something that's easy to do, you know, is to say, oh, man, these like cultural norms that I've been totally used to for my entire life, I really gotta set those aside.

Yeah, that's what I was going to say is there's not just the predators out there who are overt in, you know, harming people.

There is also this cultural conditioning and there's a willingness to deconstruct that on all these different levels and break down and build honest communication with people.

Right.

You know, so there are people that are floating around out there.

They think they're doing work, but they're so indoctrinated with these terrible ideas of consent.

They don't even realize it's about consent.

And they continue to do harm for years and years.

Absolutely.

And there's a lot of depth to deconstructing this shit.

And there's a lot of one thing that a lot of people don't either don't want to realize, because they all want to blame it on the Bat Top or the Bat Dom that's a predator.

There are toxic and predatory bottoms.

So this is out there as well.

I mean, if you're human, then you're going to wind up with the whole spectrum of good and bad, no matter who you are, no matter which side of the slash you're on.

So education has to go both ways.

The tops have to be educated.

Bottles have to be educated.

People, just people in general, have to be educated about.

What we do, I mean, what it is that we do is inherently dangerous.

We just try to do it as safely as possible.

I mean, sometimes the physical stuff we do is dangerous, like playing with the toys or hooks.

I mean, it's extensive, right?

People use knives, people do all kinds of things.

But honestly, it's like the emotional territory.

It's probably the worst.

People come in and trip out and think they're going to be okay.

And then you see stuff a lot where people fall in love with the person they're playing with from both sides.

And it's like, that was never the deal.

And then they get hurt, they get mad, and there's drama.

And that's just from that lack of education of kind of like, you come in, you see this is so weird and different.

That's a really great opportunity to be like, we can deconstruct all of this together.

Let's do it now.

Look how weird this is.

Yeah.

Let's completely break this apart.

And the rest of your life changes, honestly.

I know every person I know who really is very kinky, pretty consistent, lives a very different kind of life.

Even if they are married to one person and monogamous with that person, they still aren't living the same kind of cultural norms as the rest of society because they're like, oh, shit.

There's a lot to this consent thing.

There's a lot to openness and polyamory.

And if you've seen all this stuff and you've done all this work and you're still monogamous, it's pretty fucking righteous.

Do your thing.

At least you know what's up, and you're not going to be judging people for doing something different, which is super huge, super huge.

What I would love for newbies coming into the lifestyle, for them to be able to start at the basics as far as what is negotiation?

What is consent?

What is safe words?

What's a safe call?

Back when I was 18 to 20, I made a lot of stupid mistakes because I did not know what a safe call was.

I didn't know not to meet someone in a dark alley at 10 o'clock at night.

But that sounds so fun.

I ended up with a stalker.

I didn't know not to just show up at random people's houses that I met online without ever meeting them in person in public first, and nobody knew where I was.

Thankfully, I always got out of situations, because obviously I'm here today.

But if I could save one person, help one person to recognize that not everybody is out for their best interests, that really the person who can protect them is themselves.

And in order to do that, they need to have the right tools, they need to have the right knowledge to do it.

Well, for the younger generation, I think it's just as important as hosting, doing these classes in these shops, you also need to make as much of it available online as possible.

It has to be as accessible as possible for free because money is a thing.

They're going to go to the internet and get whatever information is available.

And unfortunately, if you go and you Google stuff, you're going to get all kinds of answers.

You're going to get good answers and you're going to get bad answers.

You're going to get the blog that's written by the predator that tells you this is how you have to do it, and then you're going to maybe on the next page of the search, you're going to find information that says, no, you can do this, there's multiple ways to do this.

There's multiple ways to be safe.

There's not just one way to do it.

One true way.

That's such a common phrase in the King's Island.

Like someone messaging you and saying that they're a true Dom, and that if you were a true submissive, you would do X, Y, Z.

Sounds good, buddy.

You know, it's like every dick pic on the planet.

That's like, that's that life for you though, you know.

It's like you put anything on your profile at all, and all you get is dick pics.

You're like, you're really, you know, good.

This is some good boo.

That's why I say that.

I mean, when I was 18, 19, 20, and I was figuring this all out, I didn't want to go to a lunch.

I didn't want to be the 18-year-old, 19-year-old at the lunch.

I was very scared.

And I didn't have anybody to go with me, and I didn't know what to do or what it was going to be like and what to expect out of it or who to talk to.

So I never went to those.

And I was on the internet.

Not necessarily just like, you know, like Googling shit, but it's, you know, accounts pop up one after the other, and they slowly pull you into the direction you need to go.

Yep.

We have all the hot queer people that are doing the stuff that I want.

Yeah.

I can do that too.

There's people in my area.

Hot milks in my area.

Yeah, exactly.

But yeah, so that the internet is incredibly involved, like in-person meeting with like your own Kink community is like that next step in it.

But it's a lot easier when you know what to expect, when you can go in with some fluff.

Yep.

Yeah, I think all 101 level information needs to be free.

Absolutely should be free.

Like I understand there's a lot of educators out there that need to make a living.

Sure.

But all that 101 level stuff needs to be free.

All the classes that we did at the house and all the labs that we did at the house are free.

It's always free.

If we're sharing knowledge, unless there's an actual cost to the knowledge, like for a flogger class, there's a cost for that to make a flogger.

It's a business, so they host classes for pay.

But like honestly, there's so much information.

There should definitely be as much free information as possible.

Yeah, when possible, film it and then do like a free edit or something.

Yeah.

Get all the key bullet points, you know.

So much information.

Because a lot.

Well, I was picking this up.

Started a conversation with my youngest son and found out that he was getting into kink.

But he was like, he was getting into kink because he went to high school with, wanted him to come down to Arizona and visit and, you know, explore.

And we started chatting about it, and it was our first conversation about it.

So it was a little bit awkward.

But I actually found it was pretty easy to navigate without being graphic.

Yeah, totally.

I immediately found myself very concerned with the types of, the sources he was getting his information from.

And so I'm like, I gave him a long list of resources.

You've got to check this out.

You have to understand these basic things about communication, negotiation.

But yeah, there's a lot of trash out there.

TikTok and whatnot.

People will get on there, watch a couple of videos, and then they're joking their girlfriend.

So my company is called Breathe Toys.

I get asked all the time why I don't make Breath Play toys.

I was like, I love Breath Play.

I've been doing Breath Play for as long as I can.

Since you've been fucking.

Since I've been fucking, basically, yeah.

But I also don't want the responsibility when I go to bed at night of knowing that I sold a toy to someone, whether they bought it online or they bought it at an event, that has maybe the most rudimentary knowledge of what safety is when it comes to Breath Play.

And then that person goes and injures or kills someone because of their ignorance, because of their lack of knowledge.

I don't want that in my head.

So I'll make them for myself, but I won't make them myself.

That's right.

Breath Play is like Kink 405.

So far from 101.

It's often people's, you know, 101 experiences.

I mean, I was a young person in this, like the early 80s when there was like the rash of dead men who would like, they were like choking themselves and jacking off and like falling off chairs.

Oh, yeah, it was huge.

I mean, it happened all over the country for like 10 years.

And you're like, Jesus fucking Christ.

Like, it's just like an increase all of a sudden.

Yeah, it was very, very common for like a good decade.

Yeah.

I guess guys were finally just like talking like, hey, man, if you choke yourself from the cum, it's fucking great, right?

Don't do it by myself.

I guess I'm going to get on a chair and do it.

Like, what the fuck are you doing?

And I'm like, hang yourself.

You're dead.

There you go, buddy.

You have nothing with that.

Just have your friend.

Right?

Put your bro friend over it.

Exactly.

That is a perfect example of having like just enough knowledge, but not quite like just this much.

But you really need this much.

I mean, how do you get people to that information, though?

That's the thing.

I was thinking about when you say it, you've got to get it online.

My experience with online information is terrifying.

Like everybody else, I've gone and searched a bunch of stuff, and any place that had good information five years ago doesn't keep it up.

Isn't it still active?

So that seems to be a hurdle with online stuff.

If you're staying active, that's great.

But you can put stuff out there that can archive well, that can age well, and is accessible to people is an interesting dilemma.

Just like with the SSC and RAC and PRICK and all the other models, play models, SSC is where everything started, and that one has been, it's not really outdated because you want to be safe and you want to be sane, and you want to be safe, sane, and consensual.

Right, and what's RAC?

RAC is Risk for Wear Consensual Kink.

And PRICK is Personal Responsibility Informed and Consensual Kink.

It's all, SSC is good, but it's also what we do is not really sane.

Sane is such a judgmental word.

Sane is a judgmental word.

And I'm like, should you not get to do Kink because you're crazy?

I saw RAC and PRICK because it makes both parties responsible for having knowledge about what you're doing.

Yes, we're going to do some breath light.

Do you know exactly what breath light involves?

What the dangers are?

What we're going to do?

Have we talked about it enough?

Maybe not.

So you have to, the bottom has to own as much responsibility as the top does.

Because both of you ultimately are responsible for what you're doing.

That's a whole hurdle, right?

That's a whole hurdle, feeling responsible for what you're doing.

Yeah.

That's not how people interact sexually most of the time.

Nope.

So.

So how people react.

Yeah.

Interact mostly in the world.

True.

Point.

You know?

Let's not get into politics.

But that's why it's kind of great when somebody walks in to a kink party, and they're like, oh, this is so different.

You have an opportunity to show them this whole other culture that is very different than they're more open to it because they're in a room with people who are half naked and half kneeling sticking out of them and like, what the fuck is going on here?

I think that's kind of where it becomes therapeutic too, because they're like, oh, this is okay.

Exactly.

It's in a safe container.

Yes, exactly.

And then they start to realize like, oh, I've been wanting things too, you know?

And yeah, it's cool.

It's cool to watch.

It was cool to experience, you know?

It's like, I enjoyed it.

It's why I enjoy helping others through that process too, because it's like, it's a big deal.

And I think it's long lasting.

Like, Adam, you're pretty stagnant, but...

Sturdy.

I mean, you're a sturdy guy.

That's real.

But I'm completely changing all the time.

It's everybody.

Everybody loves to give you shade.

Everybody does.

Because you're the opus.

That's why I just live with it.

Just accept it.

Just accept it.

Our tokens are very good.

Yeah, it's a fucking process, right?

I think that's intimidating for people too.

They just want to get their rocks off in some weird way, and then they show up and everybody's like, you need some education, my guy.

And they're like, fuck.

Yeah, totally.

Totally.

You've got to do some shadow work.

You definitely do.

I mean, you're just what is what it is.

But I think it's kind of what makes us all.

We're not all similar, but it kind of creates us as a culture, right?

Is that we're kind of willing.

We're kind of willing to be like, I'm willing to be like, Crystal, I am fucking like what you did.

I don't know what the fuck is that.

And she'll be like, well, fuck you.

That like straight up in your face, you have to kind of be that way with yourself.

You do.

And then telling somebody that you want them to like fist your vagina or whatever the fucking is you're doing, that's a big fucking move, man.

That's for most people when they can't even say like, I want to have sex, you know?

Can we do the thing?

Yeah, exactly.

That's really common.

Can we do the thing?

You know, it's like, what fucking thing are you talking about?

That's the terminology when someone comes up at a play party and they want to do pick up play.

It's like, hey, do I do a thing?

And then you're on pathway.

Tell me more.

What kind of thing do you want to do?

On what level of DVMs are we doing?

Are we going to stay at level one?

Are we just a little like spanking with my left hand?

Are we going to go all the way to level 10?

You're going to wind up bleeding on the floor.

Put that right hand because it's much stronger.

I mean, it's either naughty or nice.

It's funny because you come into the scene and you think you're one thing and you kind of aggregate yourself down to these levels.

And then you finally find your people.

And the thing that I try to get across to noobs is like, eventually, negotiation is fast.

Eventually, I know who I want to play with.

We've played a little zillion times, and we're going to, I mean, I'm always going to negotiate.

We negotiate.

I'm married to the man.

We fucking, we completely negotiate.

And I'm like, I'll negotiate every single time.

It's so quick.

You know what I don't like.

We're not doing this.

We're not doing that.

But we're going to do this.

All right?

I know that you've got a bad shoulder.

So we've played 50 times.

I know you've got a bad shoulder.

I know that.

How's your hip?

Is that still hurting you?

Exactly.

It doesn't take too long either.

It's like people think it's going to take forever.

But if there's available parties, if there's available classes, because you meet play partners in the event, it doesn't really matter.

It doesn't have to be at the party.

You quickly get through like, not my type, not my type, not that.

And then you're hanging out with the people you do want to kink with.

And then, you know, it's not true.

It doesn't take too long.

That's when things get fun.

That's the fun part.

One of the things I like to remind people is that if you're looking to pick up play with someone and you guys get to talking and one or both of the people start to think, well, you know, maybe we're not meshing, then it's okay to just say, hey, thank you anyway and walk away.

Just because you start a negotiation does not mean that you're stuck and that you have to continue.

Yeah, there is no obligation.

Exactly.

It's very autistic for me, honestly.

I'm very autistic, and it's really nice to just be able to say exactly what I'm thinking and expect that from other people too.

And they may have to work at it, but I don't.

I'm like, it's all good.

Just tell me.

Or what do you not want?

I'm at a point in my kink evolution that I have my reputations out there.

So I don't.

I'm also really horrible at reading signs.

Both.

He doesn't realize that someone's working with him.

Not at all.

So I probably miss out on a lot of play, but I'd prefer people come to me and say, Hey, I saw you doing this thing.

I heard you do this thing.

Or can we try this thing?

And one, it's a huge ego boost when someone comes up to me and says, Hey, you want to do something?

Or can you beat on me?

Are you comfortable giving me a tasting?

What's a tasting?

A tasting is when you get a taste of a certain thing, like you're at a party, for example, and you see someone getting flung, or you see someone getting a bare-handed spanking.

And you go to Cal Fish, and you're only going to ever get a tasting there.

Yep, exactly.

You go there and you see that one thing, whether it be needles, or whether it be electric blade, or a flogging, or a huge involved impact scene with the heavy bottom, which never happens.

Now, tastings are how we recruit people.

So you as the new person, or even as an experienced person, you see something with someone that you like the way they do it, you like their style, you do something about their energy, the clicks.

Then you go up to that person and you say, hey, can you give me a taste of that?

That's a tasting.

Yeah, we use a lot of lingo.

It's a culture, like I said.

And so, you know, not everyone gets them down that way.

I admire your ability to interrupt and make someone just explain real quickly.

I think that's something that I was also having trouble with.

I understand the being straightforward with everything, and I find that so difficult because I have this whole wall of how to be polite and how to make people feel comfortable about themselves and be non-threatening and enjoyable.

So I'm trying to fight that off with a fucking stick, man.

When I'm negotiating with people, especially new people, no is my favorite word.

I want to know that you know how to say no and that you're comfortable saying it.

So every once in a while, someone will come up and we'll start negotiating.

And they're like, yes, yes, yes, you can do that.

Yes, you can do that.

I'm like, cool.

What about double anal fisting?

And then usually their eyes go, bing!

No, of course.

Of course, yeah.

If they say yes, I'm like, cool, we're going to take a break and we're going to come back to this.

Or usually they're like, no, I'm like, cool.

I just wanted to know that you knew what that word was before you kept saying yes to all these other things.

Because you have to be able to say no, and no is an okay word to say.

I respect people that have no problem saying no, because you have to be able to say no.

I think it is actually a really pretty common wall to have to jump over to, to not be polite.

You know, to take away the politeness part of that interaction, especially with people you don't really know very well.

So I totally get that.

I have in my lifetime, because I am very autistic and had to teach myself how to mask really well, I'm not offended by anything in the world.

There's nothing.

You could literally do nothing to offend me.

I have mastered making people feel that from me.

So I can hang out with people who are totally vanilla and talk about my kinkiness.

They're totally fine with it.

It's because I don't care.

It's all good.

No big deal.

I'm not judging you.

We've both been that way forever.

That's a reality.

You have a distinct mask.

You are very...

Yes, people were afraid of you for many years.

That is not even funny.

That's real.

People are afraid of you.

They're not anymore.

Funny because now you're kinky and you're more real.

You're more who you are actually than you used to be.

You were a different fucking doulo.

Let's get real, my guy.

Trap driver.

How many years?

In between us fucking.

Yeah.

And you were that guy.

Really?

You know.

Come on.

My RBF is real.

Your human evolution has been so incredibly dramatic.

You have a scowl about you.

Yeah.

And people used to feel it.

They don't actually feel it anymore.

People are like, oh, it's the nicest guy in the world.

They recognize him for who he really is.

And they did not used to.

They did not.

People were like, man, what the fuck?

We were hanging out with before I moved up here.

Me and all my friends back in Phoenix were hanging out.

Someone new was there and good for them, but they actually stopped conversation that was happening.

There was like 10 people there.

They looked at me like, are you just angry all the time?

But I mean, I really do credit a lot of that quality to me, but also Kink, hard Kink, because there's so much having to like talk with different kinds of people and negotiate with different kinds of people.

And like, you are hard.

You are a pretty intense service job, but you're also a super sweet guy.

You love aftercare.

He loves aftercare.

Who loves aftercare as a top?

Do we know the big three, big five star signs of Emmett?

No?

No astrology?

Yes.

No astrology knowledge?

Yes.

Yeah, he's a Scorpio, Scorpio, Capricorn.

Uh-huh.

And I'm a Capricorn, Scorpio, Scorpio.

Yeah.

I don't know yours.

I know I'm a Cancer.

And I know that I was, I'm a fire sign.

Yeah.

And a tiger.

Yeah.

And a muscle dog.

Yes, he is a dog.

Yeah.

I'm a ratty man.

Yeah.

Yeah, I found out why I don't get along with my fiance's boyfriend all the time.

Oh, yeah.

We get along fine.

I mean, we live together.

We share a house together.

But he is a snake.

Yes.

And you're a tiger.

And I'm a tiger.

And I'm just like, oh, how cute.

I could just, you know, snap you on the back.

No, he's a great guy.

He's good for my, he's good for my girl.

Yeah.

Yes.

Yes, he is.

He's, he's a trans.

He's gotten in the past, I think, six years is how long he's been transitioning.

He's really came in to who he truly is.

And I've known him for almost five years, and he's the happiest he's ever been now, now that he's able to be in his own body.

Is Matt's Kinkie?

He is.

Really?

Is Katie Kinkie?

Oh, yeah.

Oh, yeah.

I don't think I've seen Kinkie at all.

I met Katie because she messaged my play partner at the time to ask if she took a bus from Ashland to Medford for the munch, if he would give her a ride home to Ashland after.

She was 19.

She was messaging someone who was 51 years old.

And he said, sure.

And then he messaged me and he goes, I think I kind of screwed up.

Can you message this woman and just make sure that she's okay and that, you know, I didn't just screw up by saying yes to someone I never even met.

So I messaged her and she was brand new to the lifestyle.

How about you?

Brand new.

She was super sweet, super naive, super shy.

Can't use that person though.

Yeah.

And so she made it to the munch and we met at the munch and she kept like staring at me the whole night.

No matter wherever I would walk through the room, she would just stare at me and I'm like, okay, maybe she's just nervous.

Well, come to find out she was actually perving on me.

She admits that now.

I did not realize that I was bisexual back then.

And so her flirting, way over my head.

You two are great friends.

Way over my head.

We were friends for about two years before we're like, oh, you know, maybe there's actually something here and we should explore.

So we started exploring as me as her dominant and she was my submissive.

And we did that for about five years.

And then on paper, well, if there was paper, I'm still her dominant.

She's still my submissive.

But with her being pregnant and everything right now, our dynamics very lax right now.

There's equal bratting.

Oh, yeah.

I'm clear.

Yeah, you get your bratty times and times.

The play partner that had me message her, he says that she is my payment for being a brat all these years because she can out brat me.

She's pretty good brat.

She really is.

The cute helps.

The cute definitely helps.

A little five foot one and a half.

I know I came home from work one day and she got home before me and I go into the house and I'm not finding her anywhere.

I'm like, what the heck?

So I come back outside and I hear, hey, mama.

I'm like, where's that coming from?

And she goes up here and I look and she's all the way up a day tree.

And she's like, hi.

I said, will you come down before you give me a heart attack?

Oh, yeah, she identifies as a cat.

She is definitely a feral cat.

Occasionally she likes to be petted.

She likes her treats.

She likes lots of cuddles.

And if you're not ready for cuddles, she doesn't care.

She's going to sit right on top of you.

Even if you have the laptop out, you got to move it fast because she's coming down.

She's on that chair.

So you guys are still in dynamic, right?

We are.

These two are.

Yes.

They're you're submissive, his submissive.

He's her dog.

No, he's my submissive.

We're not.

We don't have done that right now.

No.

We don't really.

We don't kink right now.

I'm busy.

I'm busy.

I'm the one.

We create leather toys together now.

We have plans to kink together.

This doesn't really work out mostly.

Scheduled in children.

Allow the universities to align a little bit.

It's just we can play with toys.

Try it out.

Do you want to tell us how Breathe Toys came about?

So I took a class on making floggers in 2017.

I need to tell part of the story.

You do, because it's what you're doing.

And so I went to this thing and made a flogger, and there was five or six other people there.

And everybody, we all got to make our flogger and get them all put together.

They didn't have the heel knots or the Turks heads on them yet.

But I finished my flogger.

Nobody else's looked decent.

I was very happy with everything that everybody made.

But pretty much everybody at the class looked at me and said, you know, I'll pay you money to make something like that.

So I lived with that for about a year and a half.

And then I started to, I was like, screw it, let's give it a try.

Well, he was like a year and a half.

I was a professional chef at the time.

So I was out at a catering job and he's like, I'm going to try it.

I'm going to make a flogger on my own.

I was an art.

I was a sculptor for a very long time.

And I know that the first time you do something is a shame.

It's bad.

He's like, I'm going to bring it out.

I'm going to come out and show you.

I mean, it's pretty good.

And I'm like, all right.

I'm thinking, this is going to be ugly as fuck.

And he brought it out.

I was like, holy shit, actually, this is dope as fuck.

I was like, well, this is what you're meant to do.

Obviously, like it was obvious.

It was beautiful.

It was like well executed and like absolutely gorgeous.

I was shook.

I know.

It's in your toy bag.

I know.

I get to play with all the first toys.

That's my gun.

Yeah, it was beautiful.

And I was absolutely shocked, shocked, not because of you in any way, but because of my own experience of like creating art.

And mine too now, because every prototypes for me and Breathe Toys are like a year long thing because it'll live in my head for a while.

And then I'll be like, all right, I think I can do this.

So I'll make a thing.

And it usually doesn't work right the first time.

And it's heavily fucked and for the longest time she would get the first prototype.

And that was at the kid camp in summer and by winter.

So by that same Christmas was our very first like vending thing.

So we went to this thing called the Black and Blue Sale, which is a Portland Mother Association, the PLA up in Portland, Padong.

And it was like their crisp sale.

And we went to that and had a table out.

And his stuff is beautiful.

It's absolutely beautiful.

And I went and looked.

And everybody else's stuff was kind of boo.

I was like, yeah, you know, whatever.

There was this one booth and there was nobody at it.

And this and her their stuff was gorgeous.

I didn't know who they were at the time.

And I was like, and I go walk over this stuff.

This stuff is like your stuff.

Like you talk to that person like that's the one.

And it was like that was Cecilia Wine.

And her stuff is absolutely amazing.

And she'd been doing it for like 35 years.

And she heard and she came over to the booth and was like, this stuff is really beautiful.

We're both circling opposite.

And I found her booth and she found my booth and she left a card.

Yeah.

And I grabbed a card and then we missed each other as we were walking because we didn't know each other.

And then I went back to her talk and she's like, oh, yeah.

And she's given a lot of advice.

Yeah, she hooked him up pretty good.

She's an amazing person.

She's like, that's nice stuff.

Yeah, that was that.

That was really that.

And it's just been like a growth process since then, honestly.

How long did it take from diving blue till you quit trucking?

Five years?

No, no, no.

You've you've not been on the truck for how long?

I've not been on the truck for two years.

It's only been two years.

Was it 2021 New Year's or New Year's 2022?

2022.

Wow, okay, so two years.

Got off the truck.

So, yeah, then that's what about four years, because you guys started in 2018.

We're almost six years old.

Yeah, now I work the day job and he makes toys for me all the time.

He works at the drink.

Yeah, right.

I mean, I love my day job, so it's cool.

I don't mind.

It's good.

And then here we are.

When Eli's not working, they go to the shop and dye his shape for him.

And then on the weekends or when I get time, I come over and put some of the stuff together.

The kids work there too?

Yes, they do.

They get everybody doing stuff.

I'll take stuff home occasionally, and Katie and I will do it together.

The whole polycule.

It works.

It does.

Max was putting screws in, I was putting screws in, and then Katie was putting screws in.

Cream soda mall.

It's a family business now.

Pretty vanilla for such a kinky business, honestly.

We're a pretty traditional family just on our end.

If you didn't know, we're all poly, but if you didn't know he had a partner, and I had a boyfriend or whatever, you'd be like, man, these are pretty traditional people for a fucking kink.

Not really at all.

That's what that one, when you talk to us, it changes.

For real.

Here we are, doing a podcast with other kinky people.

I've come a long ways from Mormon at 17.

Oh, Jesus.

Religious Trauma and Kink.

And how it's a gateway drug for kink.

A lot of regular Mormons are already poly.

And then when you leave the church, the Mormons will follow you.

Like, they found me so many times down in the Medford area, and I never gave out my address, and they would still show up at my door and find me.

They've got so much information.

They really do.

I feel like they can smell each other now.

Now I just want them to come find me at Kink Fest or something.

We could talk.

When I heard that they would do work, I would send them to my mom's house.

My mom is super anti-religious.

So I'd send them to my mom's house, and she'd be like, oh, yeah, come on in.

And she'd, like, lay them down with, like, anti-religion theory while they're, like, breaking the backyard.

It was lovely.

Breathe Toys.

Yeah, thanks for having us.

Great to have y'all.

I'm sure we will find other things to talk to y'all about.

We're fairly receptive, as long as you can fit an endorsement.

Do you have personal stories and observations you would like to share about Kink, BDSM, non-monogamy, and where neurodivergence, mental health, gender expression, community and politics all intersect?

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Goodbye.