Amandalyn Michael
Intimacy and Social Conditioning
On this episode of the Subspace Exploration Project Todd, Clay, and Ronen spoke with Amandalyn at Bloom Pleasure Coaching. Working mostly with clients that have been socialized as women, Amandalyn helps people overcome barriers to intimacy and joy that are often wrapped up in gender roles, shame and embarrassment about our bodies, and the difficulties many of us face in talking about our own wants and needs.
Amandalyn’s Website: https://www.amandalynmichael.com/
Amandalyn on Instagram: http://instagram.com/amandalynmichaelcoach
Amandalyn on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61550829053190
Amandalyn Episode Transcript
Ronen: Welcome to the Sub Space Exploration Project. A Personal Journey into Kink, Non-monogamy, mental and emotional health, gender expression and building Community. On this episode, we spoke with Amandalyn at Bloom Pleasure Coaching. Working mostly with clients that have been socialized as women. Amandalyn helps people overcome barriers to intimacy and joy that are often wrapped up in gender roles, shame and embarrassment about our bodies and the difficulties many of us face in talking about our wants and needs. Let's jump into our interview with Amanda.
Amandalyn: My name is Amandalyn and I am a women's pleasure coach. So I own a business called Bloom Pleasure Coaching.
Ronen: Can you tell us what a pleasure coach is?
Amandalyn: So I have kind of had a little bit of a struggle trying to figure out what to call myself. I'm not going to lie like I was an intimacy coach at first, and depending on who I talk to, sometimes I am a sex and relationship coach. But really what I'm passionate about is working with women to help empower them, to advocate for themselves and to discover their pleasure. Yeah.
Clay: A few years ago, I had a therapist who was a sex therapist and was during, like, a period of my life that I wasn't feeling sexual in the ways that I wanted to and had at one point.
Amandalyn: Right.
Clay: And so it was a lot of just like coaching on, like, my pleasure and how to like, how to take that back for myself. And it was good, but it wasn't what my body needed at the time. I think I just needed more time to figure out that I was like queer and trans. So.
Amandalyn: Right.
Clay: And then more pieces fell together.
Amandalyn: Yeah. Yeah. Sometimes it's sort of. It's always like an ever evolving–
Clay: Yeah, absolutely.
Amandalyn: And figuring out what feels best in your body in the moment, which is what– So I come from, like, a somatic based approach where it's like really slowing down and figuring out what feels best for your body in the moment. Because I feel like your body is your source of knowing, like it holds all of the memories and the keys to things.
Clay: It's tough when you're so socialized to be entertaining and fun and okay with everything. To then tap into what is actually fun and good for me.
Amandalyn: Yeah, yeah. So that's a big part of what I do too, is like, help people to kind of deconstruct the socializing. And so I typically work with women or people who are socialized as women because I feel like I can relate to that experience. And I have that kind of, I don't know, those experiences and kind of navigated that myself.
Ronen: You have wisdom to offer.
Clay: Yeah, exactly.
Amandalyn: Yeah. Yeah. So it's kind of I don't know, one of the things I do is I kind of debunk the fairy tale that we all live in where, you know, people don't get sex education. And so and if they do, it's like usually from porn or something.
Amandalyn: And so it's like they're what they believe is going to happen in relationships is that, you know, they're going to fall deeply in love for the one and then they're never going to have to talk and they're just going to have great sex forever. And then when that doesn't happen, they're like, Am I broken? What's wrong? Like? And then they just go to all these places like, you know, Cosmo magazine, hottest sex tips, try to fix– fix it really quick, or think that they need to buy brand new lingerie and yeah.
Amandalyn: And then they're like, why is this not working? So, like, maybe it works for a minute but not get to the root. Exactly. And I think a lot of people who are socialized as women, at least in my experience too, I felt really strongly like it was my job to please a man and to not, like, my pleasure never even was considered like ever. And so it was a lot of performing. It was a lot of trying to like win love. And nobody really considered me, you know?
Clay: Yeah, I still struggle sometimes to do like, am I doing too much? Because this is an experience that I'm supposed to do too much too, you know, And then I kind of have to, like, bring myself back down to like re reregulate and remember that I'm not performing anything. And to get in touch with the feelings that actually happen.
Amandalyn: Yeah, like what actually feels good.
Clay: you know, instead of tensing it all out, being like, this is what's happening right.
Amandalyn: It's not sexy. Like, no obligatory sex is sexy, you know, tense. A lot of women that I've worked with have told me that they have pain when it comes to penetration. And I mean, if your body is just tense and like enduring and tolerating, then, of course it's going to be painful. Your body's sending you a signal like, Hey, stop, stop doing this, allowing this.
Clay: So how do you identify and connect with people in your orbit? That's a really good question. I don't know. Can you, like, maybe ask it in a different way? Are you poly? Are you non-monogamous at all? When you're meeting people, what what kind of relationships are you looking for?
Amandalyn: So I am kind of sort of trying to figure out how to be poly. Right now I'm in a I'm in a relationship that has been monogamous for the majority of it. And then just like recently, we've kind of like tried to explore poly, but I'm not going to lie, it's been really hard for me.
Amandalyn: It's and you know, on the on the cusp of like attachment styles, I'm like an anxious attachment. And so it's like really challenging for me to regulate my nervous system when my partner is doing other things. So yeah.
Clay: Yeah, that's totally understandable.
Todd: 15 years into being fully and completely poly and I'm still trying to work it out, I'm still learning how.
Amandalyn: Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I feel like, you know, relationships in general are just one of those things that are constantly needing lots of TLC and like,
Clay: Maybe renegotiation.
Amandalyn: Yeah, because we're, we're always changing and discovering more things about ourselves.
Clay: When people are coming to you with their intimacy issues, what are some of the most common things that they're coming to you and saying, pleading?
Amandalyn: low desire is the number one reason that people seek out a coach. Yup. And, excuse me, there are basically like seven or eight reasons why people have, why they have low desire, but usually they come and they think that they're broken or something and they think that everyone around them is just having so much sex and enjoying themselves and not having these problems.
Amandalyn: But really you just don't talk about it, you know? So obviously one of the reasons can be like a hormonal thing or a physiological thing, but that is for is pathologize a lot more than it actually truly is. yeah. So usually it's more like you're stressed or overworked, you're tired is a big one that people don't realize is you're not getting the sex that you want.
Amandalyn: Yeah. So why would you be excited about it? You know?
Clay: Yep. Yeah, that. I mean, like, obviously we're a kink in non-monogamy Mental Health podcast, so I feel like at least in my experience in non-monogamy it I need the non-monogamy because I need to have my sexual cups filled right in the way that I need them filled. And most of the time the people that I am like romantic and and vulnerable and rely on for that kind of relationship support are not people that can fill that like sexual cup.
Amandalyn: Well, that's the thing. It's like nobody can fill everybody's, like nobody can fill another person's cups entirely. You just can't. And it's it's kind of part of the fairytale that somebody can, right. It's like we put so much pressure on our personal relationships to fulfill all of our needs. And one of my clients recently said something. She was struggling with the poly dynamic and she said something very insightful, which was like, How entitled are we to think that we are?
Amandalyn: We should have all of our needs met all the time. Yeah. And I was like, Wow, that's a great way to think about it.
Clay: Yeah, I mean, yes. And then there there's some people that are like, Yeah, I mean, I don't deserve to have any of my needs met. Most of the time. I'm just looking for someone who, like, tolerates me most of the time. And that crushes me.
Amandalyn: –it hurts
Clay: When I find someone thinking like that. I was like, be selfish, allow yourself to be selfish.
Amandalyn: I know, right? It's like you should be able to get what really turns you on and what you desire. You should or at least ask for those things, right?
Clay: Do you find that that is some of the common barriers that you hear or like, what are some other ones that you hear that people are just like other than like, you know, self worthiness or things like that?
Amandalyn: it's really just the conditioning that we've been brought up with. One of my clients had was raised extremely religious, and so she bears a lot of shame around sexuality and also but also feels so strongly like it's her job to please her man. And so it's it's a lot of tolerating. She's like, okay, well, let's just get it over with. And that sucks.
All: Yeah.
Amandalyn: So your body isn't isn't a thing for somebody to use. Yeah. You know, unless you want it to be.
Clay: Yeah. Unless you want it to be. And that's the thing that you've negotiated, right?
Amandalyn: Yes, exactly.
Clay: The intimacy and shared vulnerability can look different than people imagine. Are there nontraditional ways and nontraditional things that you might encourage people to try or look at if they're having relationship troubles?
Amandalyn: Yeah, I mean, it definitely depends on what relationship troubles they're having. Totally. But like I said, a lot of what I do is like helping to take away the shame that people experience and really normalizing things for them and offering them like a menu of like, okay, once we worked through the shame and normalize things and really helped you to kind of break out of your shell, what does sound good? And once you figure out what really feels good in your body and what sounds like something you're interested in, how do we convey that and get those needs met or at least ask for them?
Clay: Yeah, absolutely. That's–that's difficult.
Ronen: It's kind of like the The Body Keeps Score. Yeah. And so you're holding on to it's in your body like, how can you enjoy your body if you're holding anger, resentment, you know, fear, whatever it is, and you can't express yourself properly.
[see also
The Deepest Well by Dr. Nadine Burke Harris - https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6443356/
What My Bones Know by Stephanie Foo - https://www.stephaniefoo.me/
My Grandmothers Hands by Resmaa Menakem - https://www.resmaa.com/merch]
Amandalyn: Yeah. Yeah. And like, nobody knows how to express themselves. You know, nobody taught us that. It's hard to ask for your needs, especially, like, if at some point, maybe as a child, you did ask for your needs and then they weren't met. And then you're like, Okay, well, I guess I'm just gonna never ask for things again.
Clay: That first hurdle is getting comfortable with asking for things. And then maybe, I don't know, is the first hurdle like finding the things that you're that you want or like getting comfortable asking for your needs?
Amandalyn: Yes, it's tricky. I think it depends on the individual. But I would say starting like maybe before even asking for your needs, how about feeling like really reconnecting back to the body and feeling what doesn't feel good.
Amandalyn: And if something isn't feeling good, then we're going to stop tolerating that. Yeah. So, yeah, like being able to express, hey, I don't like, you know, I'm not really liking this and then maybe offering an alternative.
Ronen: Create some boundaries
Amandalyn: Yeah, exactly. Boundaries. And I don't know, maybe it's like fostering a sense of curiosity and, like, exploration. Right.
Amandalyn: Like, I don't know how this would feel, but let's try it and I'll let you know.
Clay: Yeah, I've done that with a few things. Yeah. Yeah, I- you said that. And then I'm reminded of all the times that, like, when my partner doesn't know what might make her feel better or what she wants at a time, I'm like, OK, well, what do you not like?
Clay: What is definitely like a no right now? And so that can like, at least lead me to know where the boundaries are kind of and then start suggesting other things based on the information that she's giving me about the no's.
Amandalyn: Yeah, definitely. That's a great way to start too, because like sometimes even still, I'm still working on my own conditioning and my partner will randomly just be like, What do you want?
Amandalyn: And I'm like, I don't know. You know, we're going to ruin the mood.
Clay: Dang. And now I'm thinking about all my wants and needs and the things that I might not have that don't make me think about that.
Amandalyn: Well, for me, it's kind of like I have no idea, because for so long my pleasure never mattered and nobody asked me what I want. So I don't even know like, what I would. You know, I need to apply my own. My own work that I help other people do to myself where I, I help them, like, see a menu of options and then figure out the intrigue for each idea.
Clay: It's a lot easier to do for others–
Amandalyn: Yes
Clay: –than it is to do for ourselves.
Amandalyn: It's true. Yeah.
Clay: What can non-monogamy do to our comprehension of how we connect with our intimate partners? That's a lot of that. Like a brainwashing gook of what things are supposed to be and why.
Amandalyn, Ronen, Clay: Heteronormative? Yeah. What is it? Heteronormative, mono-hetero, straight people, in- in a, you know, two and a half kids.
Amandalyn: White picket fence type, nuclear family, yeah. So I think that it can really help you, I mean, you have to be able to communicate to have a good open relationship or non-monogamous relationship, like you have to. So that's a really important part of it. And then holding space for your emotions and like knowing that they are going to come up and they're not bigger than you.
Amandalyn: Like, it can feel really, really intense sometimes and like navigating things like jealousy or whatever can be hard. But having a supportive partner who like, can make space for you, but also not necessarily like, stop what they're doing. You know, like–
Clay: –allow you to process.
Amandalyn: Yeah. Like, hold space and make you feel safe and give you lots of reassurance, but also not necessarily like, stop doing what they're doing because it's kind of like if, if you're having really big feelings and then they're like, okay, well, I'll just not do that thing.
Amandalyn: It just, I don't know, people go about it in different ways and that's kind of like one of the ways that people go about it. And some I mean, some people do, they're like, Hey, this is a big no for me. I think there's a difference between having like a “full-stop no”, And like, hey, “I'm having feelings about this”.
Amandalyn: Yeah, You know.
Clay: A “no” where the boundaries can be pushed a little bit, but not necessarily crossed. And then there are the “no’s” that are like, don't approach, don't cross, don’t play around about it.
Amandalyn: Especially when it comes to, like, safer sex things like that is something that we need to be respecting and but it's like if you're, if, if I'm feeling jealous because my partner went out on a date, even though I told them it was okay, that's a totally different feeling.
Clay: Yeah. That's something that's. You're doing your internal work. Yes, it feels bad, but it's not something that they need to like come save me and apologize, make me feel better. It's like, No, you can do the thing, and I understand that it's- it's all good. I'm having feelings, I'm going to get through.
Amandalyn: It can be both right? it can be.
Amandalyn: it's okay, and I'm- I'm, you know, consenting to you doing this thing, and I'm having big feelings about it
Clay: Yeah, absolutely.
Amandalyn: So, yeah.
Clay: Those both can be true.
Ronen: You definitely, definitely get big feelings when someone can like, I mean, my girlfriend or, well, relationship anarchist and like, but sometimes when she goes out, like on fancy dates, I get a little jealous because I can't do that for her.
Amandalyn: Yeah
Ronen: So, but I do other things, so I try and focus on that. But it's just one of those when you do get big feelings, you know, she and I can pretty much work it out through talking. Because I know, but I know I'm safe to go to her and say I felt a little jealousy, you know, And she'd be like, okay, that's okay.
Ronen: What do you need? Like. Yeah. So she's always really good about that. I've the first healthy relationship I've been in and the world of difference in making me want to be a better person because the other person is just so like about consent and enthusiastic yeses and
Clay: very receptive too, to like any issues that you might want to bring up with them.
Ronen: Yes, always.
Amandalyn: That's amazing.
Clay: They're never going to come at you with like, “why you feeling this way?”.
Ronen: Never, never, never. Yeah, it's always well, let's let's approach it objectively.
Ronen: Yeah. And feelings just happen. Like they happen to everybody all the time for different reasons or sometimes even no reason. We just have them. And that doesn't mean, like, you can be like, I'm experiencing jealousy, but that doesn't mean that, like, I'm completely engulfed in it.
Amandalyn: It's just another feeling that will also pass like any other feeling.
Ronen: Because I'm still happy that she gets to go out and do those things. At the same time it's like, well, okay, but you know, it still makes me happy. Yeah. So it's those two different of–
Amandalyn: Yeah that, that jealousy and compersion. Nice little cocktail.
Ronen: Yes compersion is the word I was looking for.
Clay: How might you say kink and BDSM factor into intimacy and how your clients might learn to be vulnerable with themselves and their partners.
Amandalyn: For you to be able to ask for what you want, you definitely– it definitely requires a level of intimacy and vulnerability, and especially if that's something that's maybe not like as normative or, you know, I don't know if that's word, but–
Clay: yeah, something that might be considered like taboo, to-to stray from the usual, and this is how we lay when we sex each other.
Amandalyn: Right, Right. Sure. Yeah. So, like, I'm just going to out myself and say that I have, like, I like stepping on food kink. And my partner was, like, He was like, I don't like, feet, so. So you can, like, outsource that if that's what you want to do.
Amandalyn: And I did and it was great and, you know, whatever. But it took a lot of, you know, us to be able to have like an intimate, vulnerable relationship where we could share those things. And I could even be like, Hey, there's this thing that I want to try. It's really weird, you know? Yeah. And I don't know, like, just having that safe place where I felt like, you know, even though it wasn't his thing, it was still like I could go out and explore that.
Amandalyn: And he was like, just happy for me to get my needs met or, you know, explore things. Yeah. So how does– what was the second question?
Clay: How, how might- how clients might learn to be vulnerable with themselves and their partners?
Amandalyn: It depends on how your relationship is already. So if you have like this place where you feel safe to be able to express yourself and maybe you just haven't been talking about like sex or kink in general, then I can help people to start to feel more comfortable and like actually get the language because so many people don't have the language to be even talking about this.
Amandalyn: So yeah, one of the things I do is kind of help people like, like one of my clients didn't have any language and felt really, really uncomfortable around talking about, like her genitals. And yeah, so we kind of, like, explored like what, what words I gave her like a menu of words, and she was like, really cringing about all of them.
Amandalyn: And then I was like, OK, so what do you think sounds good? And she was like, well, “flower” for– to describe her vulva. And it was like, okay, yeah, but I, I kind of was like, hey, like, maybe we should just try to say some words, and help normalize it. Like, hey, let's say pussy.
Clay: Yeah say something, say something raunchy, you know, well not necessarily raunchy, but,
Amandalyn: Well, we started like, really small.
Amandalyn: I was like, Let's whisper. And in Emily Nagoski’s book or the workbook Come As You Are she talks about, she has you do that where you kind of say these different words and maybe start whispering them and then maybe you say them like really bland, boring, and then maybe you like, yell them and just notice how each of those things feels in your body.
Amandalyn: You know, and yeah, yeah, it can be intense, but it's like, why? It's just like, it's just a sound that her face makes.
Clay: Yeah, it's that whole association of– the hole association–
Amandalyn: Well, for real
Clay: like one, just all that is, I feel like there's so much like dirty, and cleansed, keep it to yourself,
Clay: shameful feelings around our genitals. And perhaps especially vulva owners.
Amandalyn: But we all have them. Like we all have genitals and, in some form or another so,
Clay: like they're there
Amandalyn: What's the deal?
Clay: And they're, they got hair. They're stinky sometimes.
Amandalyn: And bodies are gross. Like they make fluids, they make sounds, and sex is not meant to be neat and clean.
Amandalyn: But that's what we see perceived in, like, porn most of the time. Unless it's a man's ejaculation. So, you know, it's- if people are getting their education from that, then it's kind of like feeding into a false reality and then setting you up for expectations that might not be what reality actually is
Clay: setting yourself up for disappointment at the very start.
Amandalyn: And then you're like, well, my sex doesn't look like this. So what’s– I'm wrong? Like, I'm not doing it right or, you know, you're worried too much. Like, you just need to be more in your body and not worry as much about how it looks or if you have belly rolls or, you know, if you queefed or whatever.
Clay: Yeah, yeah, no the making sounds when air gets pushed into any holes, I'm always like, it's fine, whatever, it's fine.
Amandalyn: I just try to laugh about it, I laugh for a second and then I'm like, yeah, let's keep going. Like, you can reframe it, right? You can, like if like I queef, then it's because I'm so- I'm so wet for you. You know.
Clay: Yeah. You got so far inside of me that you pushed so much air up and up into me.
Amandalyn: It's like, Damn, I'm so juicy.
Clay: Exactly. You just flip it. You just take something that doesn't feel erotic. Or maybe it feels shameful to you, and you– you f– you make– you eroticize it and you make it– you make it–
Amandalyn: –or even just like taking some of the pressure off of sex, having to be like this serious thing all the time.
Todd: You find that laughter, humor can be a good tool to get people to relax around some of these things, some of this conditioning?
Amandalyn: Yeah, sometimes it's like, think about the word that is the most cringey to you, and just like, I don't know, yell it or, like when we were in middle school, we used to play like, the penis game
Clay: That's what I was thinking, when you were like “just whisper it”.
Amandalyn: Had to, like, start yelling penis in public. It's like, yeah, we're awkward around this stuff because that's how our culture is. And the more we talk about it and the more that we think about it and have podcasts about it, whatever, you listen to it, then like the more normal it's going to get and then we're going to be able to relax more into our body, you know?
Amandalyn: And that's where, like all the good stuff lies.
Todd: Is there anything you would want to share?
Amandalyn: Yeah, so my website is bloompleasurecoaching.com and you can find me on Instagram @bloompleasurecoaching. It's all pretty straightforward. Bloom Pleasure Coaching all across the board, including my email [@gmail.com]. And then I am accepting new clients at this time and I'm really excited to work with more people.
Clay: Talk to Amandalyn, talk to Amandalyn!
Clay: All right.
Ronen: Well, thank you.
Clay: Thank you so much.
Amandalyn: Yeah, thanks for having me.
Ronen: And that was Amandalyn at Bloom Pleasure Coaching. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of The Subspace Exploration Project.
Todd: Every episode you can join us for a plunge into kink, non-monogamy, sex education,
Clay: deconstructing the Gender Binary Queer culture and Building healthy Communities. Please comment like share and subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube, Acast and RSS.
